• Home
  • About
  • Contact
  • Patreon
  • Premium Membership
  • Services

Natural History

by Scottie Westfall

Feeds:
« Chow Chows have interesting gaits
Chow-types in Hong Kong »

When retriever color gets somewhat confusing

February 25, 2009 by SWestfall3

red-chesapeake

Remember how I said that it can be hard to tell a brown-skinned red to yellow dogs from some shades of liver?

Well the Chesapeake Bay retriever is a breed that comes in only brown-skinned colors. All Chessies are brown-skinned red to yellows or livers.

The dog pictured above is most likely a brown-skinned red dog. You would get this same color in a brown-skinned golden or most tollers. In Chesapeake parlance, it is a “sedge.”

Now, the dog above was relatively easy to assess. What about this one?

anomalous-color

This dog is probably a very dark red Chesapeake, but it approaching something like what we seen in “chestnut livers.”

The dog below is a chestnut liver.

chesnut-liver-chessie

Chespeakes also come in “deadgrass,” which is something like what we call light gold in golden retrievers.

deadgrass

Chesapeake Bay retrievers come in colors that were associated with the Tweed water dog or Tweed water spaniel. In fact, my reading of the descriptions of the Tweed water spaniel suggest that they looked a lot like slightly smaller chessies.

These light yellow puppies could be born to liver dogs, so they were called “light livers.”

In Chesapeake Bay retrievers, black skin pigment does not exist. That means there really is no consequence of misindentifying a chestnut liver or a very dark red.

When the golden was split off from the flat-coat, it was decided very quickly that goldens would have black skin. Brown-skinned goldens are extremely rare. This trait in the Tweed water dog was bred out of them. It still pops up every once in a while, but it is rare compared to the black-skinned red to yellow.

Why did goldens have to have black skin?

Most sources say that the brow-skinned dogs had rather hard expressions.

However, I think there is another good reason.

If you breed a black skinned red to yellow to a liver, you can produce black puppies.

If you’ve accidentally moved a chestnut liver into the golden registry, which did happen, and breed it to a mahogany or dark red golden, chances were pretty good that the puppies would be black. If you breed a brown-skinned red to yellow to a black-skinned red to yellow, you will most likely get a litter that is a heterozygous black-skinned red to yellow in color. However, if that so-called brown-skinned red to yellow is actually a reddish liver,  the puppies will probably be black in color.

Because it is sometimes hard to tell a red to yellow with brown skin from a liver, you simply make brown skin an undesireable trait. Then you don’t have the confusion.

Posted in Uncategorized | Tagged Chesapeake bay retriever, retriever color, retriever color genetics | 5 Comments

5 Responses

  1. on February 25, 2009 at 4:36 pm flattie-n-Labbie

    You need a photo of one with a mask. If I find a good one, I’ll send it. They’re pretty cool. :)


    • on February 25, 2009 at 4:47 pm retrieverman

      Like this?: http://www.geocities.com/petsburgh/farm/1276/shdeadgr.html


  2. on February 25, 2009 at 6:42 pm flattie-n-Labbie

    yup, that’s it. They can be pretty distinctive.

    Official Chessie colors: Brown, Dark Brown, Light Brown, Deadgrass, Light Deadgrass, Sedge, Tan, Ash. The Chessie people seem to get very uptight about what colors are what; I can’t actually tell them apart. And I always forget sedge and ash and have to look them up (yes, I did the internet cheat and looked them up).

    They are an interesting dog; I haven’t known enough to know if I “get” them–they’re a little different than the other retrievers, for sure. Those who have them are very loyal to the breed.


    • on February 25, 2009 at 6:50 pm retrieverman

      I have a very hard time telling them apart. It’s just like all the colors that ferrets come in. I can discern only two: albino and non-albino.

      I have a hard time figuring out reddish livers from true reds.

      And to make matters worse, red means liver when you’re talking to a Doberman person or someone in kelpies, border collies, and Australian shepherds. And kelpies and BC’s come in the same color of red as golden retrievers in addition to the liver red.


    • on February 25, 2009 at 7:00 pm retrieverman

      Don was a “sandy liver” flat-coat. He was probably a reddish liver.

      His sire was Lucifer, one of the yellow dogs bred by the 1st Baron Tweedmouth. Lucifer was what we’d call a golden retriever today.

      This is where it gets really confusing about color. Don obviously carried the yellow color. This was back when goldens were nothing more than a color variety of flat-coat, so you wound up with a wide range of colors that could be livers or true reds or yellows.



Comments are closed.

  • Like on Facebook

    The Retriever, Dog, and Wildlife Blog

    Promote Your Page Too
  • Blog Stats

    • 9,810,960 hits
  • Retrieverman’s Twitter

    • one person followed me // automatically checked by fllwrs.com 1 month ago
    • one person unfollowed me // automatically checked by fllwrs.com 2 months ago
    • @TetZoo Cougars/Puma/Mountain Lions have kittens, as do cheetahs because they are not Pantherines. 2 months ago
    • @SergioStalino Message me. I got lots of tips on catching and cooking. 2 months ago
    • @SergioStalino What kind of reel? 2 months ago
  • Google rank

    Check Google Page Rank
  • Archives

    • September 2020
    • August 2020
    • July 2020
    • June 2020
    • May 2020
    • April 2020
    • February 2020
    • January 2020
    • December 2019
    • November 2019
    • October 2019
    • September 2019
    • August 2019
    • July 2019
    • June 2019
    • May 2019
    • April 2019
    • March 2019
    • February 2019
    • January 2019
    • December 2018
    • November 2018
    • October 2018
    • September 2018
    • August 2018
    • July 2018
    • June 2018
    • May 2018
    • April 2018
    • March 2018
    • February 2018
    • January 2018
    • December 2017
    • November 2017
    • October 2017
    • September 2017
    • August 2017
    • July 2017
    • June 2017
    • May 2017
    • April 2017
    • March 2017
    • February 2017
    • January 2017
    • December 2016
    • November 2016
    • October 2016
    • September 2016
    • August 2016
    • July 2016
    • June 2016
    • May 2016
    • April 2016
    • March 2016
    • February 2016
    • January 2016
    • December 2015
    • November 2015
    • October 2015
    • September 2015
    • August 2015
    • July 2015
    • June 2015
    • May 2015
    • April 2015
    • March 2015
    • February 2015
    • January 2015
    • December 2014
    • November 2014
    • October 2014
    • September 2014
    • August 2014
    • July 2014
    • June 2014
    • May 2014
    • April 2014
    • March 2014
    • February 2014
    • January 2014
    • December 2013
    • November 2013
    • October 2013
    • September 2013
    • August 2013
    • July 2013
    • June 2013
    • May 2013
    • April 2013
    • March 2013
    • February 2013
    • January 2013
    • December 2012
    • November 2012
    • October 2012
    • September 2012
    • August 2012
    • July 2012
    • June 2012
    • May 2012
    • April 2012
    • March 2012
    • February 2012
    • January 2012
    • December 2011
    • November 2011
    • October 2011
    • September 2011
    • August 2011
    • July 2011
    • June 2011
    • May 2011
    • April 2011
    • March 2011
    • February 2011
    • January 2011
    • December 2010
    • November 2010
    • October 2010
    • September 2010
    • August 2010
    • July 2010
    • June 2010
    • May 2010
    • April 2010
    • March 2010
    • February 2010
    • January 2010
    • December 2009
    • November 2009
    • October 2009
    • September 2009
    • August 2009
    • July 2009
    • June 2009
    • May 2009
    • April 2009
    • March 2009
    • February 2009
    • January 2009
    • December 2008
    • November 2008
    • October 2008
    • September 2008
    • August 2008
    • July 2008
  • Recent Comments

    The Evolving Natural… on So does the maned wolf break t…
    SWestfall3 on So does the maned wolf break t…
    Ole Possum on So does the maned wolf break t…
    kuymal on The Thylacine was more a marsu…
    Kerry Rogers on The Thylacine was more a marsu…
  • Meta

    • WordPress.com
  • Pages

    • About
    • Contact
    • Patreon
    • Premium Membership
    • Services
  • Subscribe to Retrieverman's Weblog by Email
  • Revolver map

    Map

  • Top Posts

    • Were Romulus and Remus really nursed by a she-wolf?
  • SiteCounter


  • Donate to this blog

  • Top 50 Northwest Dog Blogs

    top 50 dog blogs

Blog at WordPress.com.

WPThemes.


 

Loading Comments...
 

    %d bloggers like this: