The Old Southern Hound.
Coonhounds, foxhounds, beagles, harriers, and bloodhounds are thought to have descended from two ancestral English hounds. These dogs were the North Country beagle and the old southern hound.
Now, I will claim that the bloodhound is at least partially descended from these dogs. However, the official history is that these dogs descend from the dogs kept at St. Hubert’s Abbey in the Ardennes. However, I found a somewhat iconoclastic breed historian who claims that the bloodhound has a British origin and was always distinct from the St. Hubert’s hound. As someone who also thinks breed historians should be willing to look at the historical record more closely, I can’t help but mention it.
The old southern hound was rather like a bloodhound or a coonhound in build. It had long, heavy ears and a pendulous dewlap. It came in all the colors we associate with hounds, so maybe the best way to think of this breed is that it was something like a cross between a foxhound and a bloodhound. Maybe another way of thinking of these breed is that the beagle is supposed to be a bred-down version of this dog, just with shorter ears and no dewlap. Its influence is probably strongest in American coonhounds, and I would not doubt that it may have had some influence in the development of the British lines of bloodhound. These dogs were meant to track old scents and follow a blood spoor, usually while leashed.
Ninteteenth century beagle that shows some influence of the southern hound.
It may have been derived from the Talbot, which was a white hound of rather nebulous ancestry. The Talbot may have been derived from the actual St. Hubert’s hound from Belgium, or its ancestry could have come from some sort of French white hound of which there were many breeds. Some of these exist today, like the Billy and the Porcelaine.
This old southern hound’s geographic range was south of the River Trent. It would make sense that this hound would have a bit more influence from dogs from the continent.
North of the River Trent was the North Country beagle. It was a cross between a heavier hound (maybe a Talbot) and a greyhound. It was faster on the trail than the old southern hound. Its influence is more strongly seen in foxhounds, trailhounds, and harriers, which were developed from crosses with this breed and hounds that were used run stags.
Out of these breeds, we get a plethora of British hounds. It is likely that French hounds and other continental breeds had some influence in these dogs, but from the late Medieval period to the early eighteenth century, the main hounds in Britain were the southern hound and the North Country beagle.
Can you cite a couple sources fortalbots for me, please? The one I’ve got (and I’m travelling, so I’m paraphrasing from memory :P) says they were a sometimes-wirecoated, white or pale tan with a likely connection to otterhunting hounds, another link between the big wirecoated deer and wolfhounds and the smaller, lighter fox hounds and greyhounds.
Yes, there were griffon version in both of these breeds. An otterhound is derived from the griffon old southern hound crossed with bloodhounds and French griffons (especailly the Griffon Nivernais).
Here are some sources on the NBC:
http://books.google.com/books?id=B2ECAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA76&dq=north+country+beagle&client=firefox-a#v=onepage&q=north%20country%20beagle&f=false
(that one is about smooth-haired and rough-coated varieties of the NCB)
http://books.google.com/books?id=xjmM-KbzK9wC&pg=PA277&dq=north+country+beagle&client=firefox-a#v=onepage&q=north%20country%20beagle&f=false
Old Southern hound:
http://books.google.com/books?id=cSkBAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA188&dq=old+southern+hound&client=firefox-a#v=onepage&q=old%20southern%20hound&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=xBoGAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA289&dq=old+southern+hound&client=firefox-a#v=onepage&q=old%20southern%20hound&f=false
Now, for Talbot: http://bloodhoundclub.co.uk/History/60.htm
http://www.britainexpress.com/counties/derbyshire/houses/Haddon-Hall-Photos/Haddon-Hall-Photo-21.htm
That last one is a talbot in the heraldic sense, but I’m not sure that it actually represents a ‘real’ breed of dog (in the sense that the heraldic panther and heraldic leopard don’t represent the real animals). I’m trying to find the book that I was thinking of now that I’m home, but all my books are a mess right now.
Well, you’re right. The actual Talbot was a white heavy hound that came in griffon and smooth varieties. It was probably the most common dog among the nobility in England from the Norman Conquest to the end of the Middle Ages.
I can’t comment on hounds generally, or upon the Bloodhound, but I have spent a lot of time researching the Otterhound.
There is solid evidence for the out-crosses with French Griffons and indeed wolf-dogs in the second half of the 19th century. There is also evidence that this was two-way – some Nivernais\Vendee breeders incorporated Otterhounds.
The distant origin of the Otterhound is unknown. Texts written in the 19th century appear to describe different types of dog. All these writers speculated about the breed origin but none claimed any evidence to support their thoughts.
The earliest written and photographic evidence shows a breed type consistent with the modern Otterhound was being hunted by the Hills of Hawkstone and Lomax of Clayton Hall in the mid-1800s and these packs – and several others – originated in North-West England in the first half of the 19th century. All the evidence indicates this is the core of the modern breed, albeit with frequent out-crosses as befits dogs that were bred for purpose.