Canis lupus hominis

Posted in Uncategorized | 24 Comments

24 Responses

1. on April 7, 2010 at 3:36 pm jen

   i joined!

   I heard today that the curly coat retriever is the original “doodle”. Is that true? Have you done posts on curly coats?

   
   
   • on April 7, 2010 at 3:45 pm retrieverman

     I’ve heard that before.

     But I don’t think it’s true.

     Curlies are so unlike any doodles. They shed a lot, for one thing.

     And there is no proof that they have true poodle in them.

     They are derived form water spaniels in some way.

     They are either:

     1. St. John’s water dog/water spaniel x– like the Tweed water dog was.
     2. They are an aboriginal black water dog native to England that is a relative of the water spaniels or was crossed with them. They are the ancestor of the St. John’s water dog.

     2. is heretical.

     Water spaniels are derived from a poodle type ancestor, which Shakespeare and other called “water rugges.”

     See the following posts:

     1. http://retrieverman.wordpress.com/2009/10/01/the-history-of-water-dogs/
     2. http://retrieverman.wordpress.com/2009/05/21/descriptions-of-the-old-type-water-dogs-from-markham-and-shakespeare/

     
     
   • on April 7, 2010 at 3:45 pm retrieverman

     BTW, thanks for joining!

     
     
   • on April 7, 2010 at 3:49 pm retrieverman

     Here’s another you might like: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=106829992691087&ref=mf#!/pages/Anti-Cesar-Millan/97584126794

     
     
2. on April 7, 2010 at 4:45 pm EmilyS

   I wonder if you-know-who or the other you-know-who will become a fan…

   
   
   • on April 9, 2010 at 9:29 am Sengimage

     ???

     
     
3. on April 7, 2010 at 5:17 pm Jess

   Facebook is a tool of satan.

   
   
   • on April 7, 2010 at 6:17 pm Pai

     I refuse to social network. I rather enjoy pseudonymity, thank you very much! =P

     I guess that makes me old school.

     
     
     • on April 7, 2010 at 9:16 pm Jess

       I have had a presence on the web under my real name since 1994. I kept my dog posting pseudonymous mostly because cross-breeding and not breeding for conformation showing tends to attract psychotics. But then I couldn’t post our dogs on our blog, which ended up seeming stupid, so I outed myself. It turns out it’s rather amusing to play with the psychotics.

       
       
       • on April 7, 2010 at 9:28 pm Sengimage

         Ya think? LOL.

         
         
       • on April 7, 2010 at 9:52 pm Pai

         Well really, the nuts can’t do much except rail at you and send nasty letters, right? Not like their tried-and-true weapon of social ostracization can really work on people who refuse to join their little club in the first place. =P

         
         
         • on April 7, 2010 at 10:12 pm Jess

           No, we are lucky because there’s no animal control in our part of the county. Making false calls to AC is pretty SOP for the real hard line crazies. I also live in a Castle state. That doesn’t put off the really persistent idiots but the ones who are just looking for an easy way to make themselves bigger by harassing you will bug off.

           I find the weird groupthink and reinforcing behavior with these people really fascinating. Some psychologist should do a study.

           
           
   • on April 11, 2010 at 9:59 pm Bridget

     Yes Jess it is, and the virtual world may be some times his hall.

     
     
4. on April 7, 2010 at 8:47 pm Sengimage

   Unfortunately I spend more time dealing with the security issues caused by the WEB 2.0 environment and Social Networking sites like FaceBook… So in the interest of security, and not wanting anything with analytical backends running on my computer or networks.. I must pass. It was hard enough going through TeenyChat for me.

   ;-)

   
   
5. on April 7, 2010 at 8:48 pm Pibble

   Joined! Yay for Retrieverman!

   
   
6. on April 8, 2010 at 9:01 am bill

   I can’t figure out what an “Irish Staff” is. Is that the same as an SBT?

   There is a very famous dog from the 1980’s that is refrerred to as both, but neither seem like definitive sources.

   
   
7. on April 8, 2010 at 10:08 am bill

   I think i found my answer, the Irish Staff is a unicorn, so to speak. Not an SBT at all.

   
   
   • on April 8, 2010 at 10:19 am retrieverman

     There’s also a Blue Paul terrier that comes from Scotland.

     Most of the blue pits are derived from this dog, although it’s likely that many have Neapolitan mastiff in them.

     Neapolitan mastiffs are often blue. I would’ve expected them to come in chocolate, vanilla, and strawberry.

     
     
     • on April 8, 2010 at 11:09 am bill

       Irish Staffordshire Bull Terrier, from what i can tell is a name that unsavory characters gave their competition dogs to avois BSLs.

       Not exactly fair for the plucky little SBTs in Great Britain, especially the perfectly nice ones who have the misfortune of growing too tall.

       
       
       • on April 8, 2010 at 7:52 pm EmilyS

         wrong again, Bill (what a surprise)

         
         
         • on April 8, 2010 at 10:05 pm Bill

           Seriously? Then an Irish Staff is an SBT in Ireland or something else entirely?

           
           
           • on April 8, 2010 at 11:45 pm Bill

             You definitely know more than me a about the specific categories within the breed group, but some pretty serious sounding people say that there is no such thing, and never really was.

             It would certainly indicate some flaws in BSL logic/practicality if APBT people over there could so easily co-opt the name of a (mostlly) unrelated dog.

             If they’re just “pure” SBTs it would be interesting too…

             
             
8. on April 8, 2010 at 7:55 pm EmilyS

   There’s plenty of evidence for the Blue Paul/Poll which is generally accepted to be part of the early bull terrier heritage (back before the split between the “bull terrier” and the “Staffordshire bull terrier”. Blue was a color that always existed in the SBT and its offspring breeds, the APBT and subsequently the AST. These dogs were correct, normal “standard” size. It is quite possible that the current oversized “not an APBT pit bulls” have been mixed with the blue mastiffs, but since they’re mutts anyway, I’m not sure I care.

   
   
9. on April 8, 2010 at 9:01 pm Pai

   Apparently Blue Pauls tended to suffer from Color Dilution Alopecia as well, since they were actually mentioned as a type of hairless dog in ‘Modern Dogs’ (pg 412): http://www.archive.org/stream/historydescripti00leeriala#page/412/mode/2up

   
   

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