Natural History

Posted in Absolute Piffle | 24 Comments

24 Responses

1. on February 10, 2013 at 9:40 pm nancy

   The saddest thing is that this was a pastor. Also, the server was fired.
   Pretty nasty pastor.

   
   
   • on February 11, 2013 at 9:56 am bearcoatpei

     Don’t you just love it when supposed Christians act in the most petty, mean (financially and spirited), unchristian like of manners. Shame on that pastor who will be expecting the congregation to tip them 10% next sermon. What a prize dick!

     
     
     • on February 11, 2013 at 11:44 pm Pai

       The Sunday Afternoon Church Crowd are renown for being terrible tippers, just in general. You hear many stories of these people not even tipping at all, and just leaving gospel tracts on the table. Their lack of awareness of how much they’re being assholes is staggering, really.

       
       
2. on February 11, 2013 at 3:17 pm Peggy Richter

   why should someone pay someone else extra to do their job? The whole concept of “tipping” is odd. in the US, it’s wrong to “tip” a cop or a firefighter, but one is supposed to tip a bellman, waitress & barmaid. How about the barman? Do you tip the teacher of your kids each day? How about the grocery clerk or bagger? Not the nanny and yes for the maid? Not your surgeon or the nurse — how about the candystriper that cleans the bedpan? No for the office typist or secretary? — and of course, in some countries, you DO tip the police, etc or you regret it. — it differes in various cultures who you do and don’t tip and by how much.
   and yeah the guy was rude, but why should one pay more than 10% ? or any tip at all? why not just pay a realistic wage and quit expecting that customers will make up the difference if you don’t?
   I think the basis of tipping is twofold. One, to reward prompt, efficent service The second is, I believe, a hold over from charity — to pay those who are less fortunate (which was usually service people). But why go from 10% to 15% to 18% (and next I’m sure to 20%)? A lot of service folk won’t give decent service if they don’t get what they think is a good tip — but again, if you expect one person to do their job on a paycheck without a bribe to do “more”, why expect that another shouldn’t have to? (or that you should pay for what they are supposed to do in the first place)?
   It’s a custom that we argue is based on charity, etc, but it really is a means by which additional payment is made instead of just charging the correct amount at the start — and which while it is SUPPOSED to be reported to the IRS, often isn’t. http://people.howstuffworks.com/tipping.htm

   
   
   • on February 11, 2013 at 3:36 pm massugu

     Because they receive less than minimum wage for their work, thats why! If you dislike the idea of tipping take it up with the owners and managers of the restaurants.

     
     
     • on February 12, 2013 at 3:12 am Dave

       The owners won’t take it into consideration. It would mean raising the prices, and falling out of competition. One would have to contest the politicians to demand good pay for kitchen staff and waiters.

       
       
   • on February 12, 2013 at 3:11 am Dave

     Because waiting a table is not paid the same way in North America as it is in Europe. In Europe, the cost of the menu items are significantly more expensive than our own restaurants in Canada and United States. This is to cover the wages of the staff.

     However, for some reason, people in North America insist on cheap food, and forcing the cooks and waiters or waitress to rely on tips to make an income.

     
     
   • on February 12, 2013 at 3:19 am Dave

     “Tipping the police”. Isn’t that more like bribing? Thankfully, we never had go through that while travelling eastern Europe when people warned about police officers demanding a tip from tourists who are taking a road trip.

     
     
3. on February 11, 2013 at 3:34 pm massugu

   Badda…bump!

   
   
4. on February 11, 2013 at 5:22 pm Peggy Richter

   yes, Massugu, I think if you read what I wrote, I mentioned that many are paid less than minimum wage by their official employer. And that is right how? And aren’t OTHER folk paid less than minimum wage? Do you tip all of them? and in other countries, where you pay the cops, do THEY make less than minimum wage? and if so, does the tipping make it “acceptable” as a system? If so, why not every other job? And why should the delta be 18%? why not 10? or 20? Why not ALL their wages via “tipping” and the official employer simply allows them to work and earn tips only?
   The issue isn’t that tipping exists, or that there is a conventional view that some jobs are “ok” to be paid less than minimum wage and the customer is supposed to make up the difference with tiips. The issue to me would be should that be the case? and if so, why 18% as opposed to any other percentage?

   
   
   • on February 11, 2013 at 5:39 pm Jessica

     It’s probably a concept along the lines of a commission, which basically means people have a direct incentive to try harder. Unfortunately, some people are just scum – with a commission if you make the sale, you get the reward, with tips that’s very much not a certainty.

     At Starbucks, the tips are extra on top of a regular wage (above minimum wage, might I add) and it was a good measure of customer service performance. It was nice to have those few extra dollars in the pocket towards gas, and you felt like you directly earned it through your awesomeness.

     
     
   • on February 11, 2013 at 7:31 pm massugu

     Once again I say talk to the owners and managers of the establishments. I don’t think you’ll get very far though.

     So, do we not tip the service personnel to punish owners/managers? Somehow I don’t think that that’ll be too effective.

     As for myself, if I get decent service I tip 20%, if not, I tip 10%–the message gets thru to the staff pretty quickly. Would I prefer that wait staff get minimum wage or better and health benefits? Yes! (but I’m not holding my breath.) Can we change the system? We can try. (But again, I’m not holding my breath.) In our present Dickensian culture where management cuts full-time staff to avoid paying health benefits, while said management lives in $billion mansions, I don’t see them embracing the thought of paying wait staff a living wage any time soon.

     As for taxing tips, most municipalities assume a 15% gratuity and tax accordingly. So if you tip less, the waitstaff lose money .

     As for other countries, its a case of when in Rome…

     And although I’ve never tipped a cop anywhere I’ve traveled, living in a high-rent district (i.e., the DC metro area), where cops, firemen and teachers often can’t afford to rent much less buy accommodations in many of the municipalities they serve, we might just want to consider it.

     
     
     • on February 11, 2013 at 8:52 pm nancy

       Having been in hospitality for over 40 years, here is my opinion about tipping. Managers have to keep many more staff than they really need so that during the busy times, people are not screaming about slow service.If they were to pay a higher wage, you, the customer would be shocked at how high your dinner bill would be. So pay your tip and shut up or go home and cook it yourself.

       
       
     • on February 12, 2013 at 3:25 am Dave

       I think Peggy is embracing the European mentality where a tipping culture in restaurants does not exist.

       However, she also forget Americans love the illusion of cheap food. Look at legislation on food quality. Americans start whining when prices go up accordingly to new regulations when in the long run, healthy eating alieve the healthcare system and tax-payers don’t have to pay so much to support the system. On the other hand, wages are so low, people are forced to buy cheaper food if they want to maintain their lifestyle.

       
       
       • on February 13, 2013 at 6:16 am bearcoatpei

         In England, if you tip your bar tender, waiter/waitress or taxi driver, they nearly faint – he-he! I personally do tip for good service, but only in independently owned businesses or the self employed like taxi drivers. It’s never expected and usually only consists of about a pound or less. The only chain I frequent is a department store and they don’t allow tipping in their cafe.

         
         
5. on February 11, 2013 at 6:27 pm Southern quebec

   Sweetie, if you read the whole story you would have read that the 18% was added to the bill because the group was over 6 people. Applebee’s told them before they sat down that there was an 18% service charge. By ordering they agreed to pay it.

   Nice rant though…

   
   
6. on February 11, 2013 at 8:49 pm Peggy Richter

   if they agreed to a 18% charge before ordering, they should have paid. Regarding massugu, if you want to pay, no problem. I’ll note that the site Retrieverman cites has two “earlier” references, one which mentions a racial slur put on the receipt by the server and one which mentions a “fat” slur put on the receipt by the server. So you’d reward that with a tip of 10%? I sure wouldn’t. So you don’t have a problem with the bonus that some CEOs get for THEIR service? Or only specify tips for those paid less than minimum wage?
   I think Jessica has a point. As a “reward” tips (or bonus, incentive pay, etc) has a value in encouraging a person to do their “best”. But if it becomes a requirement or “the standard” then it loses that value. I think the cultural concept of who, how much and in what circumstances is interesting. I also think that a “mandatory” tip is not a tip at all. It’s just an extra charge that isn’t on the label and I rather prefer to know what the price is supposed to be before I order. If i CHOOSE to pay more because the service pleases me (or I’m kind) then it is MY choice how much to give and if I give.

   
   
   • on February 12, 2013 at 12:17 pm kittenz

     I agree; tipping should not be an entitlement, but a reward for excellent service. I always tip, unless the service has been really bad or the waiter has been really rude. My first job in high school was as a waitress & we relied on tips; wages were so low that it didn’t pay to go to work if you didn’t get good tips. But I think that we need to do away with the archaic notion that some employees aren’t entitled to minimum wage because they receive tips. Change the laws so that they are paid at least the legal minimum wage, and then if they want to receive a good tip as a bonus, they will provide that excellent service. I would not mind paying a little extra for restaurant food, knowing the employees make a halfway decent living.

     
     
   • on February 12, 2013 at 5:47 pm massugu

     I wouldn’t have half so much heartburn w/ executive bonuses if they weren’t incentivizing failure. Also, with them, I don’t get any input at all.

     Again, do I think that wait staff should get better wages? Yes. But, do I think that’s gonna happen any time soon? I think Dave and some others here have quite eloquently answered that question already.

     As for requiring a tip, remember, the wait staff is still taxed as though they got 15%. If you don’t tip or if you undertip, it comes out of their pockets in two ways.

     While we’re on the subject. When I eat out, I always make an effort to be polite and considerate with wait staff–you know treat them as though they’re fellow human beings rather than some form of chattel–and wonder of wonders, I almost always get excellent service.

     Oh and in that case, I do leave a decent tip. I consider tipping for good service part of the experience of eating out. If I’m too cheap to tip, I’ll stay home and heat up a can of soup.

     One final thought. The reason that tips are so often included on the bills of large parties is that large parties are most often the ones guilty of not tipping (some cheapskates don’t even cough up enough for tax and their drinks.) Having been stuck with those costs at a Christmas party once, I can tell you that it was greatly resented–by me, the wait staff and the management. Fortunately for the last two, I made up the difference out of pocket–a painful process as at the time I was working 3 jobs to support my family.

     
     
7. on February 12, 2013 at 2:49 pm ChathamHillDogs

   At the end of the day all the tips can be a pretty good take if the waiter was managing several tables and on top of things for everyone. In an environment where there is pay rate below minimum ( which I think is technically illegal) a good server will net a decent take home amount daily. Depends entirely on the clientele and the demographic locale of the establishment. I tip all the time… But I do have the right to either tip more or less depending on how well I felt the service was. But, I always tip keeping in mind that as a tradition and a matter of culture its just the right thing to do. Or the establishment can include the gratuities in the bill and clearly state that. Or if it becomes a matter of constant Sunday Worshippers like this Asshat coming in and always stiffing the servers… you can post a sign that clearly states we have the right to refuse service to whomever we want…. And post pictures of the people who frequent the establishment and never tip.

   Then you’ll see how quickly this same type of ass hat will either choose another place or start tipping when it gets around that he’s refusing based on giving tythe to the church and that very same contribution goes right back in his pocket along with the income from the congregation.

   Makes you think… organized religion is … the oldest form of organized crime. Taking from others in the name of the Invisible man.

   
   
   • on February 12, 2013 at 5:49 pm massugu

     Very well put!

     
     
   • on February 12, 2013 at 6:01 pm kittenz

     Actually it is legal for employers to pay employees who receive tips less than minimum wage in direct wages, as long as they make enough in tips to have net pay of at least the minimum wage. Some states have additional state laws pertaining to tipped employees, too.

     According to the US Department of Labor: “An employer of a tipped employee is only required to pay $2.13 an hour in direct wages if that amount plus the tips received equals at least the federal minimum wage, the employee retains all tips and the employee customarily and regularly receives more than $30 a month in tips. If an employee’s tips combined with the employer’s direct wages of at least $2.13 an hour do not equal the federal minimum hourly wage, the employer must make up the difference.”

     So they have to be paid at least the minimum wage, but more than $5 of that $7.25 per hour can come from their tips.

     
     
8. on February 13, 2013 at 12:05 am landauer

   Give us this day our daily bred

   
   
   • on February 13, 2013 at 5:58 pm Jessica

     You can’t bred, you’re spaded.

     
     

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